Curse

capitalist · Apr 08, 2007, 07:17 AM // 07:17

Markis. Pwnt.

Dorian...

...Pwnt.

Ended up having a friend that need THK, so he brought his Derv, and a Toucher.

Kinda sad.

Div · Apr 08, 2007, 08:28 AM // 08:28

Touch rangers own. I don't know why people bash on them ^ ^

ss1986v2 · Apr 08, 2007, 08:47 AM // 08:47

touch rangers are actually pretty strong in the right pve environments. one time, just for a laugh, i brought a touch to thunderhead keep. it worked rather well all the way to the keep. nothing to rave about, but killed some stuff, with dmg taken never really an issue. where it excelled was at holding the keep.

it was a very bad pug. like 3 warriors, i think 2 where wammos. 2 crap healing monks, and maybe a nuker. i forget. anyway, we split 4-4 on each door. my 4 held, fortunately, the other 4 didnt. so eventually the other 3 wandered over to help the struggling team, and left me alone on the other door. and they didnt come back.

but it wasnt an issue. i was able to hold the other door the whole time, with no help from any of them, or any support from the catapult. AI never kites (at least then it didnt), so it was an endless stream of life steal coming in and going out. keeping stances and throw dirt werent even that important with the constant life steal. the funniest part was that after it was over, i realized than one of my pieces of armor wasnt even infused.

ahh, fun times goofing off in pugs.

Sword · Apr 09, 2007, 08:19 AM // 08:19

touch rangers in pvp are sorta useless imo
never actaully seen one in pve

but what gets to me is why touchers dont use 40/40 blood weapons... they always have staves.... with 40/40 you get a ton more damage if u are using a staff, and 40/40 on oob produces a ton more energy...

guess people that play touchers dont really know how to make builds better than what they saw on guildwiki....but I guess thats why they are playing a toucher build in the first place =/

FoxBat · Apr 09, 2007, 08:54 AM // 08:54

Because the touch skills are "skills" and not "spells."

You could go for 40% recharge on OoB, not much point in 40% casting time though.

Lydz · Apr 09, 2007, 09:21 AM // 09:21

I think touch skills should be made into spells. A mesmer has no way of going against one (last time I checked) because Backfire, Mistrust etc. just won't work on them. You can't use Empathy, and Conjure Phantasm etc. isn't much use against the lifestealing.

Maybe there is an anti-toucher mesmer build...but the problem is that it would probably only be useful again touchers, which doesn't help against everyone else.

Yanman.be · Apr 09, 2007, 10:11 AM // 10:11

Lydz, diversion. ggkthxbai.

themeteor · Apr 09, 2007, 11:14 AM // 11:14

Touchers are ok, its just when they try to tank aggro about 6-8 mobs and die like the lowest of low stereotypical wammo only to insult everyone and type "res me!!!!!!1"... for the 6th or 7th time.

Mournblade · Apr 09, 2007, 01:09 PM // 13:09

themeteor: That has nothing to do with touch rangers and everything to do with people who don't know how to play the game. =)

I tried a few combinations of weapons and for me, a +5energy/+5armor weapon and 27/-1 offhand work best. (with OoB, not Serpents Quickness)
Then again, I haven't had the pleasure of hunting as part of a team of Touchers. I can see how that would be handled differently.

capitalist · Apr 10, 2007, 05:42 AM // 05:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lydz

I think touch skills should be made into spells. A mesmer has no way of going against one (last time I checked) because Backfire, Mistrust etc. just won't work on them. You can't use Empathy, and Conjure Phantasm etc. isn't much use against the lifestealing.

Maybe there is an anti-toucher mesmer build...but the problem is that it would probably only be useful again touchers, which doesn't help against everyone else.

Mesmer Elite: Tease.

A waste, but a solution.

RhanoctJocosa · Apr 10, 2007, 05:48 AM // 05:48

Thought it'd be more obvious; Diversion>touchers. Seeing as all they do *is* spam, you don't even need to take much care when throwing Diversion around. Just do it. Gg.

*EDIT: I'm aware that the duration Diversion lasts has been reduced to 6 seconds but that should be enough time to snare/kite/heal up. Also, if you don't like Diversion use Crippling Anguish and degen them to death. : D

bungusmaximus · Apr 12, 2007, 01:11 PM // 13:11

I can recall seeing a screenie of a 6-toucher team winning HA, the comedy. A simple AB-er knows how to deal with touchers, guess the HA crowd just wasn't used to them :P. Since zealous benediction touchers don't pose much of a threat anyway. I always love it when some ape in AB makes a 4 toucher team. Turn on local chat, sit back, and don't forget to bring popcorn. I LOVE TOUCHERS, people always play them for the sake of being an ass, they're just funny as hell.

bungusmaximus · Apr 12, 2007, 01:14 PM // 13:14

I can recall seeing a screenie of a 6-toucher team winning HA, the comedy. A simple AB-er knows how to deal with touchers, guess the HA crowd just wasn't used to them :P. Since zealous benediction touchers don't pose much of a threat anyway. I always love it when some ape in AB makes a 4 toucher team. Turn on local chat, sit back, and don't forget to bring popcorn. I LOVE TOUCHERS, people always play them for the sake of being an ass, they're just funny as hell.

Faer · Apr 12, 2007, 02:06 PM // 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sword

but what gets to me is why touchers dont use 40/40 blood weapons... they always have staves.... with 40/40 you get a ton more damage if u are using a staff, and 40/40 on oob produces a ton more energy...

guess people that play touchers dont really know how to make builds better than what they saw on guildwiki....but I guess thats why they are playing a toucher build in the first place =/

Well a pair of 20/20's doesn't actually add up to 40/40, but other than that...

+15e, +60HP > +12e

That's why Touch Rangers use staves. Or at least, that's why I use a staff when running a TR.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lydz

Maybe there is an anti-toucher mesmer build...but the problem is that it would probably only be useful again touchers, which doesn't help against everyone else.

As previously stated, Diversion is pretty harsh on TR's, and Crippling Anguish works wonders on them as well as Warriors, Assassins, Rangers, and Paragons (not as much on the last two, but effective nonetheless). You can easily counter a TR as a Mesmer with quite a few Illusion builds, and even a couple Domination ones.

ss1986v2 · Apr 12, 2007, 03:04 PM // 15:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

+15e, +60HP > +12e

That's why Touch Rangers use staves. Or at least, that's why I use a staff when running a TR.

well, thats not entirely right. i assume your staff looks something like this:

* Energy +10
* Cold damage: 11-22 (req. 9 Blood Magic)
* Halves skill recharge of spells (Chance: 20%)
* Energy +5 (while health is above 50%)
* Health +30
* Health +30

but with the sword/offhand route you could have this:

* Cold Damage: 15-22 (req. 9 Swordsmanship)
* Health +30
* Energy +5

* Energy +12 (Requires 9 Blood Magic)
* Halves skill recharge of Blood Magic spells (Chance: 20%)
* Health +30

so its actually 15e, 20% HSR, +60 hp vs 17e, 20% HSR, +60 hp.

you lose the ability to wand, but i usually bring a high energy wand/offhand set to make sure i can put down a target if things get tight, so i still have that option as well. never understood why someone would run 2 less energy and 5 conditional energy just to get the ability to wand. agreed on the duel 20/20 though. its not as hot as a lot think when you look at all you can get with a sword/offhand.

Faer · Apr 12, 2007, 10:28 PM // 22:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by ss1986v2

<snip>

Indeed; weapon swaps are key. I carry both a staff and a martial/focus set with me when I TR (which is rare these days, as I'd rather play Mesmer or Monk). Probably should have mentioned that in my post, but I suppose hindsight really is 20/20.

Nexus Icon · Apr 16, 2007, 06:58 PM // 18:58

I always found that snares were very effective against touchies in FA.
Pump illusion and spam Crippling Anguish, Ethereal Burden and Kitah's Burden, then chuck in some extra degen with the likes of Conjure Phantasm and Phantom Pain. Finish off with some Images of Remorse and Clumsiness for when the touchy summons her big bad wammo friend to help when she can't touch the nasty mesmer, and bam, yer done.